Regading the new cube rotation in Beta5

Discussion in 'Parallels Desktop for Mac' started by oxonian, Apr 27, 2006.

  1. schmidp

    schmidp

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    49
    Am I the only one whos screen flickers after the cube transition?

    It seems like the vm first changes the lcd resolution the window resolution of the vm, and then back again to full resolution.
    Again: MacOS X 1400x900 with Windows at 1280x800 -> alt+enter -> cube transition -> Screen to 1280x800 (flicker) -> Screen to 1400x900 (flicker).

    I don't think these resolution changes are needed.

    And yes, I've unchecked "Change Mac OS X resolution"

    greets philipp
     
  2. ryanm1903

    ryanm1903

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    8
    that would certainly be an awesome option to have, and would be convenient for first-time installers who dont want to figure out that they have to run two different programs to create their desired effect. running a guest OS in its own window within the primary OS is definitely much more comfortable when full screen mode isnt needed. but i do agree that the current mode of transition is a bit edgy at best, and would love to see a virtualized desktop method of switching implemented.
     
  3. drtimhill

    drtimhill

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    85
    Let me see if I can summarize what I see as the ask...

    PW should really be able to run a VM in one of a couple of different display modes:

    (a) Windowed mode, where the PW VM screen appears in a Window on the Mac OS X desktop. This is the default mode at present.

    (b) Full-screen mode, which is a toggle from mode (a) to full screen where the Mac OS X desktop is replaced by the VM screen. This is pretty much as-per the Beta4 and earlier implementation. (Note that others have asked (and I concur) that in an ideal world the VM would switch resolutions to match the native Mac screen resolution when going full-screen, but that may be a limitation of Windows, and if you read on I don't think its needed if....)

    (c) Flip-screen mode (NEW). In this mode, the PW VM screen does not appear *at all* on the Mac OS X desktop except as some kind of small iconic form (? menubar, dock?). Clicking on this icon (or maybe an assigned shortcut) initiates the cool window rotation to the (full screen) VM display. Ctrl+Option in flip-screen mode then returns to the Mac OS X display with the icon visible.

    I think there is one very compelling argument for mode (c): If I setup a Windows VM for the correct resolution for full-screen, the windowed display is inevitably clunky since much of it is off-screen on the Mac OS X desktop. So when I do choose to set Windows to full Mac screen resolution, it kinda makes windows mode useless anyway. This is where "flip-screen mode" is so great -- I can setup Windows for full-screen resolution, and then flip back-and-forth between Mac and Windows full-size desktops! Awesome. :)

    Tim
     
  4. macmansc

    macmansc

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    10
    Problem with Command (Apple) + H

    Maverick using your method, do you have a problem when going back to Parallels that it seems as if the "Alt" key is being held. Until I once again use the command (apple) key, I'm stuck with shortcuts. For instance, going from full screen with command-h, coming back by clicking on the dock icon for parallels. Once Parallels is the front most app, type "R" on the keyboard. It brings up the "run" box. It seems to occur in windowed or full screen mode.
     
  5. maverick808

    maverick808

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    167
    Yup, I get that exact problem and I have to just tap the Apple key once to fix it. Hopefully they'll fix it soon.

    As a sidenote I experienced the same problem with Apple's own Remote Desktop where whenever I logged into a remote machine it would behave as if the Apple key was being held down. Their latest Remote Desktop 3 release seems to have fixed that though.
     
  6. e7sharp9

    e7sharp9

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    29
    The command key is mapped to the Windows key (at least on the MBP). I used remapkey from the Windows Resource Kit Tools to change this to some innocuous character since I never use the Windows key anyway. This solves the Windows shortcut key problem when coming back to PW.
     
  7. flafeer

    flafeer

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    11
    I'd have to agree that Virtue + Parallels works flawlessly on my MBP to do exactly what most people seem to want.

    Option- left arrow and I'm in full screen OS X. Option-right arrow and I'm cubed over to full screen Windows 2003. Option- left and I'm cubed back home. All I had to do was change the default keybindings in Virtue.
     
  8. Richard Hunter

    Richard Hunter

    Messages:
    49
    I don't seem to be having the issue most of you are having.

    What I do is set the resolution to, say, 800x600 or 1024x768 in windows WHEN IT IS RUNNING IN A WINDOWED MODE ON OS X...

    Then, when I choose full screen, I get the cube effect, cool... and when I hit ctrl-option to have it rotate back to OS X, it goes back to the 800x600 or 1024x768 that I had previously set up in Windowed mode!

    :)
     
  9. dave

    dave

    Messages:
    3
    Use the cube with Mac OS's built in application switching

    I'd like to add my $0.02 worth... :)

    I completely agree with oxonian and others about all this, and some of the suggestions are excellent.

    In it's simplest form, what we want (at least what I want) is one or more cool, one-step ways to switch from full screen Mac to full screen Windows and back again, as if they were two completely independent environments, rather than Windows being a window in an application within the Mac OS (even though that's really what it is). Virtue provides this, mostly - it is still beta and, at least I've found, it has a couple of issues - but also, it would be great to have this functionality built into Parallels.

    That said, there's more issues here:
    1. Reality is, one OS is an app within the other OS (so how do we make that work nicely?)
    2. Multiple VM's running at once?

    Here's a comprehensive outline of what I reckon could work. In short it's simple: just tweak the built in application switching!

    Not so short...
    With all this talk of hot keys etc, I'd like to point out that a keystroke for switching between the Mac OS and multiple VMs is already ridiculously simple. When multiple VMs are open, it seems to me that each one is a new instance of the Parallels application. I actually like that, because then you don't have to build into Parallels some way of managing the computer's resources between all the VMs (It's already handled by the Mac OS and there are tools already available for tweaking that if we really want to). So then, switching between open VMs, and between them and the Mac OS, is as simple as command-tabbing between applications. This is particularly nice, because:

    (a) the guts of this is already written and built into the Mac OS - ridiculously easy, i would think, for the Parallels team to write (all you really have to add is some special routines for what to do when a Parallels instance is brought to the front, and, when a Mac app is brought to the front over a Parallels instance).

    (b) switching Mac applications (whether by command-tabbing or clicking in the dock or whatever else) is something we're all already used to so there's no new keystrokes for users to have to remember.

    The only thing you really need to change is, instead of what we have in B5...

    (apologies to oxonian for slightly modifying his words)

    ... instead implement:

    I'll just add that it would be nice if each instance of Parallels could be given a different icon in the application switcher window that shows up when you press command-tab, and the dock, so that we could tell which is which, when multiples exist. Perhaps the Parallels icon, but with a small version of the appropriate OS for the VM in the bottom right corner of it or something like that.

    It just needs to be clean. I think this suggestion is on the right track...

    (thanks drtimhill)

    ...but I would just say that the Ctrl+Option to get back to Mac OS X is not necessary and I've never liked that bit (my thanks go to the Parallels team for the Mouse Synchronisation Tool). Simply command-tabbing between Mac apps and each VM / instance of Parallels really should do the trick, and handle multiple VMs really cleanly.

    Note that I'm not suggesting some special handling of command-tabbing. I'm suggesting some special handling of every form of application switching on the Mac. Whether that's command-tabbing, or choosing an icon in the dock, or hiding applications by pressing command-H or whatever.

    It would simply be that whenever any Mac app is chosen while a PW VM is in front, the cube or whatever swivels to the Mac desktop, bringing that Mac app to the front, but it should then send itself to the back (or even hide itself). That last point is important because as someone has already commented, if I switch from a PW VM to Text Edit, and then quit or hide Text Edit I don't want the PW VM to then be the active app and/or cube back in - I want the last Mac app that I had at the front to come forward, even if I haven't used it since using the PW VM I was last in. So some special handling of when any Mac app is brought in front of a currently front-most PW instance is required, but I think that's ALL that's required.

    Then when I explicitly choose any PW VM (by choosing it's icon in the dock, or command-tabbing to it or whatever else other than hiding or quitting the current Mac app), it then brings it's instance of PW to the front just like it would for any mac app, but only then in doing so, would it display the cube or whatever other effect was chosen while doing whatever else it does to hide the menu bar, dock etc. in full screen mode.

    In this way my entire Intel Mac can behave as if it's got multiple OS's on it concurrently, but when any one OS is the one I'm currently using, it appears (just looking at the display) to be the only OS on the machine. Switching between them, and/or starting them, is no more complex for the user than switching or starting any other app, and I don't believe coding all this should be terribly difficult. It's almost already there. And we still have all the benefits of synchronised clipboard etc. along with this.


    A couple of further comments, since I've been writing this for most of the day, and others have chimed in, in the meantime:

    For what it's worth, Virtue is just about able to do what I'm suggesting. It is possible to bind an application to a desktop, and most of the time, switching into that app switches to the appropriate desktop if necessary. Sometimes it fails though. I've filed a report on it. But assuming it will soon work the way I think it's meant to, then binding each instance of Parallels to one desktop and every other application to one other desktop gets the result I'm proposing.

    I'd actually hate it if that's all that was implemented in Parallels. I don't want to have to remember yet another, not one, but in the above case, two special keystrokes to get the result. I frequently use the built in application switcher (command-tab) on the mac so it's nothing extra to learn or get in the habit of.

    That said, I have nothing against flafeer's suggestion being implemented in addition to my suggestions as an option, as I appreciate that some people might want to separate the method of switching applications within one OS, from switching OS's. But while I think the latter is possibly cooler... in practice I think switching applications is more useful...? Just my thinking.


    Sorry this is all so long. Hope it helps.
    David.
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2006
  10. tomhalv

    tomhalv

    Messages:
    28
    If Virtue is setup with only two desktops (1 row, 2 columns) and one desktop is set for binding the Parallels app, you only need to use one keystroke to switch between the OS X desktop and the full screen VM desktop. I think this is as simple as needed.

    This software is unbelievably good at this point!! Keep up the great work!
     
  11. markup

    markup

    Messages:
    14
    Show your friends how the switch works with this silly video.

    Thanks, Parallels!

    Enjoy!
     
  12. mattham

    mattham

    Messages:
    8
    Guys - every beta release is getting better & better -well done!!

    I think the "virtual desktop" is definately the way to go with full screen mode.

    I have just installed Beta 5 & Virtue - set up 2 virtue desktops (osx & winXP) & switch between desktops via option+tab. I have bound the parallels application to the winXP desktop so that when it's running, clicking the dock Icon "cubes" me to winXP.

    Is there a way of setting up virtue so that an app will only run on it's assigned desktop? ie when I start parallels it automatically switches to my WinXP desktop & runs it on there or do I have to make sure I'm on my xp desktop before I start Parallels?

    Anyway other than that minor little thing (which I know has nothing to do with you) - It's working awesome - keep up the good work.

    Matt :)

    BTW - the other thing I've done is in my XP VM (thanks to the new folder sharing) I've mapped a drive to my "My Documents" folder on my boot camp (fat32) winXP partition & remapped my VM's "My Documents" to that drive. So I have the same "My Documents" folder in VM & Boot Camp (plus a link to it on my OSX Dock)
     
  13. mattham

    mattham

    Messages:
    8
    Ok - so the Option tab seems to do something weird with the XP VM alot of the time & turns my double clicks into "show properties" clicks. Changing the virtue keystroke to control + left arrow or right arrow seem to work much smoother
    Matt :)
     
  14. blshaw45

    blshaw45 Bit Poster

    Messages:
    33
    Yet another vote

    Count me as yet another very pleased PW user who would like to see this mode added in a future release.
     
  15. MicroDev

    MicroDev

    Messages:
    122
    First, it is amazing the speed at which these features are being implemented. I envision a giant bare-chested development manager beating on a tom-tom in the middle of a group of chained up engineers. Great job.

    Second, the whole full-screen rotation is somewhat confusing in how it works with regards to the other host applications and the visual feedback.

    Try this to see my dilema:
    1) Turn off automatic resize Mac resolution
    2) Turn off automatic full screen
    3) Open parallels and enter full screen mode
    4) Command-tab to the finder and start iCal.

    Notice how the menu for iCal appears but no windows for the application do? You have to go back to Parallels, recapture the display, hit Alt-Enter (or Ctrl-Alt) and then the other app windows pop up but Parallels now has the focus. You can now Ctrl-Tab again to get to iCal. That's a lot of steps to simply switch desktops.

    My recommendation:
    When switching apps (Ctrl-Tab or middle mouse button, etc.) and when selecting Parallels, if the guest OS is already in FS mode, then cube rotate to it. Similarly, when leaving the focus of Parallels and in FS mode, rotate away from that desktop (as in the suggested Virtue combos). If not in FS mode and switching focus among apps, act normally with no visual effects.
     
  16. tomhalv

    tomhalv

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    28
    MicroDev,

    I like that last idea.... Only use the cube rotation when the VM is in FS.
     
  17. david

    david

    Messages:
    26
    With every new feature comes added issues, problems, things that need to be supported down the road. I think the functionality is very good as it is,...I hope Parallels can focus on fixing bugs and getting the VM working with the best possible performance level, and not building a window manager - that's what virtue is for!

    Props to the parallels team for implementing the virtue code as quickly and effectively as they have already done. I am not against small tweaks down the road, but I think the team would be better server to work on something else for a time.

    One idea might be to sort out the interface for organizing and setting up VM's, and for adjusting preferences of Parallels (the ones mentioned in this thread about OS X resolution,. etc). The app is wonderful, but it doesn't feel very Apple like...and some settings are very difficult to find. I have a feeling half the suggestions and complaints in this thread could be satisfied if people only knew where to find the settings.
     

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